The WAR on Drugs

[MurphOnMillerAve]

This guy did his homework, on the war on drugs: https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/what-novelist-don-winslow-thinks-of-americas-war-on-drugs

Thank you, Roy.
I watched the Mr.Winslow interview in its entirety, twice, and found myself wishing somebody would put the entire interview on every national news program, right away.

The perspective expressed by him is important news.

Of course, I realize there are voices on this forum which will, right away, make fun of me for accepting TV News programs as legitimate sources for news or anything meaningful, but I don't really care, frankly, very frankly. I think what you have provided here is well worth national attention, via the News programs or whatever.

Thanks again.
Murph
I'm a teacher, so I value learning from others.

[up148]

Apples and aardvarks, Talk about linking 2 things that have nothing to do with each other at all.

Only point I was making is there are both misnomers IMHO. Not associated in any other way.

BH

[up148]

You know, maybe this Winslow fellow is correct in saying "legalizing all drugs", but only if the government and bleeding hearts don't try to rehabilitate people who become addicted.

Maybe this is the "Darwin Theory" of the 21st century. Get addicted, OD and die. It will be very painful until enough die or cause enough social and financial devastation to our country, that a new generation recognizes drugs are bad and makes some major sweeping changes to our laws.

BH

[robert.]

Philadelphia is building a safe drug house. People will be allowed to shoot up ,sniff or smoke. Whatever their choice is. Staff will not hand out drugs. They will give clean needles and revive people that O.D.

[MurphOnMillerAve]

You know, maybe this Winslow fellow is correct in saying "legalizing all drugs", but only if the government and bleeding hearts don't try to rehabilitate people who become addicted.

Maybe this is the "Darwin Theory" of the 21st century. Get addicted, OD and die. It will be very painful until enough die or cause enough social and financial devastation to our country, that a new generation recognizes drugs are bad and makes some major sweeping changes to our laws.

BH

Are there any parallels in the USA with our experience here with alcohol, Prohibition, and re-legalizing the use of alcoholic beverages? I had heard ("urban legend"?) that Prohibition was only able to be passed because so many men were away at WWI, and that as soon as the men returned from combat, they got the law repealed quickly.

For example, I remember that when I was a youth, a State Liquor Store was the only place a customer could buy "hard liquor(s)" in Pennsylvania. Beer could be bought at specialty distributors, and bars, as take-out; I'm not sure where folks bought wines. I have a strong impression of no alcoholic drinks of any kind being available at grocery stores.

How it is these days, in Pennsylvania, I have no idea.

I'm wondering if any of this experience with alcohol consumption in the USA has any relevance to what we are considering here about recreational drugs and "drug abuse."

[rogruth]

Murph,
I think it is similar.

[Roy]

I had heard ("urban legend"?) that Prohibition was only able to be passed because so many men were away at WWI, and that as soon as the men returned from combat, they got the law repealed quickly.

Prohibition wasn't repealed until 1933.

[MurphOnMillerAve]

Help me out, Roy. How is that an important -significant enough for you to mention it out of all the possible points one might deduce from my statement about drug abuse and alcohol use in the USA - point in the discussion ?

[Roy]

Help me out, Roy. How is that an important -significant enough for you to mention it out of all the possible points one might deduce from my statement about drug abuse and alcohol use in the USA - point in the discussion ?

I don't know why you cited the urban legend you did, either. Are you not familiar with the history of prohibition, and what lead up to it?

[MurphOnMillerAve]

Well, you are the superior one. What not educate me in this regard?

[Roy]

Well, you are the superior one. What not educate me in this regard?

I'm not superior to anyone, so cut that silliness out. There was a series on PBS not long ago about Prohibition. I'm sure you can find and view it online. You can probably read about it a lot quicker on Wikipedia.

[MurphOnMillerAve]

I was trying to make an overarching point, comparing the drug problem with alcohol prohibition . You chose to focus on minutiae . Disappointing. But. Hey. What difference does it make. Did we accomplish anything pertinent to the largerquestion? Nope.

What a wasted effort on my part. Sorry .

[Roy]

I was trying to make an overarching point, comparing the drug problem with alcohol prohibition.

This is my argument, from another thread:

Any thinking person learned from alcohol prohibition that the black market built organized crime. That was the unintended consequence of a supply side solution which abridged the liberty of Americans. What actually works is telling Americans the truth about the consequences of, for instance, smoking. This is essentially a demand side solution, and respects the liberty of Americans. As they say, know the truth, and the truth will set you free.

You create a black market, especially in a wealthy country with porous trade borders, and it will build organized crime everywhere. Not all countries have the resources to battle this, and more sophisticated criminals have learned from our political system's weaknesses how to manipulate the government's policies.

One of our political system's weaknesses is it's private campaign financing system. The wealthy can support both sides in an election, and win influence regardless of the election outcome.

[MurphOnMillerAve]

I was trying to make an overarching point, comparing the drug problem with alcohol prohibition.

This is my argument, from another thread:

Any thinking person learned from alcohol prohibition that the black market built organized crime. That was the unintended consequence of a supply side solution which abridged the liberty of Americans. What actually works is telling Americans the truth about the consequences of, for instance, smoking. This is essentially a demand side solution, and respects the liberty of Americans. As they say, know the truth, and the truth will set you free.

You create a black market, especially in a wealthy country with porous trade borders, and it will build organized crime everywhere. Not all countries have the resources to battle this, and more sophisticated criminals have learned from our political system's weaknesses how to manipulate the government's policies.
....

Makes perfect sense to me.
I had wanted to see if anybody would bring a consideration of organized crime into the mix, and you did. Very pertinent, indeed, Roy.

[robert.]

You could still get alcohol during prohibition. Doctor were allowed to prescribe it.
https://prohibition.osu.edu/american-pr ... al-alcohol