What's New on the PRR Panhandle Division?

[rogruth]

George - based on the look of your backdrops, you've got plans for a mountain that goes all the way to the ceiling? Looking forward to seeing that...

Healey

I have a mountain to the ceiling. I'll see if I can find a photo.

[healey36]

I'm regretting not going higher with mine. It would look a lot better if it were a bit steeper. It would be easy to tear off the top and redo...maybe later after I get some of the electrics sorted.

[G3750]

Look what you can learn on an exceptional model train forum. Can't do this on most.

This! x1000 What a fascinating side-conversation. I learn the most amazing things on this forum from some very well educated and gracious contributors.

George

[G3750]

George - based on the look of your backdrops, you've got plans for a mountain that goes all the way to the ceiling? Looking forward to seeing that...

Healey

Yes, that is the evil plan. Depending on how the space actually looks, I'm thinking about some layers of items to force perspective. From top to bottom:
Layer 1: N scale foliage and high tension power lines (I have 2 towers to use). Very common to see those running along or over ridges in this part of the country.
Layer 2: HO house(s) and foliage. My wife is going to assemble the HO version of the Bates house kit to sit on 4th Street above a tunnel entrance. Steubenville's 4th Street (north) is the Victorian district.
Layer 3: O scale - Lionel coal tipple, mine head, Sasquatch, Yeti, deer, bears, hunters, heavy foliage

I very much want to see Roger's mountain as well.

George

[G3750]

Updated 1/9/2016:

"Several steps forward and one step backwards" would describe today's progress.

In the forward department, a smaller backdrop depicting sky (it will go behind and slightly above Backdrop #3) was painted by my artist friend. She also completed a section of Backdrop #2 that had been missed. Backdrops #1 and #2 were mounted last week. They look better and better to me.

A family friend (whose 3-rail layout I designed and am helping him build) came over and we started to play with the track geometry from where the two tracks will leave the western end of the bridge. The bridge is not yet in place, but we anchored the position of the track (4.5" center rail-to-center rail).

Things started getting complicated. I thought I had a working plan for laying out the western mainline and attaching it to the coal mine spur, but it didn't come together. There is a mistake in the RR-Track plan; it may have been there for quite a while. I had the wrong length of straight track in front of the curved switch (No. 2). The real track (9.5”) was shorter than the one on the track plan (15”). That is significant.

Here's what the track plan originally looked like:

v228Panhandle10x18-w3.gif (115.36 KiB) Viewed 3401 times

There appear to be several track geometry options open to me. No matter what, the first step is to complete the mainline track from the northwest corner of the layout around to Switch No. 1.

I will need to adjust the length of the straight pieces in the mainline to make sure the mainline curve fits correctly on the table top. After that, playing with the length of the straight near the curved switch (No. 2) may give me a chance to mate the spur with Switch No. 1 without replacing the O42 curves. I hope to keep the tipple tracks (north of Switch No. 2) intact.

Alternatively, I will look at using O31 curves in the coalmine spur and seeing what they do to the overall geometry. Again, the idea is to not move the tipple tracks.

If those two alternatives fail, then we will adjust the tipple tracks and curved switch (No. 2) as needed. This is the least favorite option.

Here's the area as it stands today:

From the bridge approach looking west. These are the anchoring track pieces for the rebuild.

W_Rebuild_35_.JPG (42.95 KiB) Viewed 3401 times

Here is the mainline curve area. You are, however, looking at the Coal Mine Spur track.

W_Rebuild_36_.JPG (43.41 KiB) Viewed 3401 times

George

[Steamfan77]

George,

I know how it is, it has to not only look right, but work right. I'm going through your entire build thread from the beginning. I admire the thought and effort you're putting in to your layout. I'm up to page thirty so far. What a great journey, and thank you! Keep up the great work

Andy

[G3750]

Thank you, Andy.

Frankly, it's been a humbling experience. I never thought it would be so hard to do correctly. At the beginning, my ambition outstripped my capabilities. I have been paying the price for bad execution for quite some time. Fortunately, I think I'm getting on the right side of that curve. I keep building that list of lessons learned and pray I will get to re-do this layout when we retire.

I appreciate your readership and all the folks who follow my on-line mental meanderings. I hope I am helping them as much as they are helping me.

Best,

George

[robert.]

"I have been paying the price for bad execution for quite some time. Fortunately, I think I'm getting on the right side of that curve. I keep building that list of lessons learned and pray I will get to re-do this layout when we retire."

Model railroader's mantra.

[G3750]

Model railroader's mantra.

Boy, isn't that the truth. At least I don't feel so bad about it.

George

[G3750]

Updated 1/10/2016:

While thinking about the track geometry for the western mainline rebuild, I came across another “side project” that needs my attention. And as long as I “have the patient on the table”, I figured I should address it.

As trains travel west across the bridge (northernmost track) to Ohio, they encounter an MTH PRR signal bridge with a 7-light position signal at its western end. Beyond the signal is a straight section of track that enters a tunnel. The straight track section has an insulated rail that triggers a DZ-1008A relay which in turn activates the signal. When the track ahead is occupied, the signal displays the STOP aspect. Otherwise, it shows the CLEAR aspect.

Within the tunnel is Switch No. 3 (yeah, I know that wasn't a good idea). This is where the Hidden Passing Siding joins the Mainline. Again, the only direction of travel possible is counter-clockwise.

Currently, the signal protects the approaching train only against an occupied Mainline track. It does not protect against Switch No. 3 being set against the Mainline. That is something that I want to correct, as a derailment or collision inside the tunnel would spoil everyone’s day.

Switch No. 3 is a Curtis HiRail O54 right-hand switch operated by a Z-Stuff DZ-2500a switch machine. The switch machine is activated by either TMCC (using the DZ-2001 Data Wire Driver) or the DZ-2502P pushbutton mounted in the fascia. I cannot use the non-derailing feature of the switch machine as it is possible for a train from the Hidden Passing Siding to be occupying the switch when another train approaches via the Mainline. Throwing a switch while a train occupies the points would be bad, very bad. Adding a provision to cut power to the Mainline straight when the switch is set against it seems like overkill and doesn’t modify the signal aspect. I prefer the engineer to be in control of the approaching train and be watching the signal for instruction.

Here's a rough drawing of the area.

Tunnel Protection.jpg (22.82 KiB) Viewed 3360 times

Anyway, I am looking for a way to address this. Current thinking is to use a second DZ-1008a relay activated by the DZ-2500a switch machine and just have both relays activate the MTH signal. I'm going to play around with a possible wiring diagram and post it later this week.

Thoughts, comments, concerns? Solutions or alternatives welcome, too.

George

[MurphOnMillerAve]

You sure do a heckofa lot of detailed planning, George. I admire that quality.
Murph

[healey36]

George - Seeing your schematic above reminds me I need to run the update for my iPad for the cloud.

Thanks.

Healey

[Steamfan77]

George,

The devil is in the details...that said, I tweaked my RR track plan for a year before laying a single piece of track. And even then just as you've mentioned in prior posts, I still had to make a few adjustments because of the discrepancy between software and real life. And oh by the way, I've had my share of oh s*** moments. Keep messaging things until they are the way you want them. I'm enjoying your journey immensely.

Andy

[G3750]

You sure do a heckofa lot of detailed planning, George. I admire that quality.
Murph

Thanks Frank. The devil or the genius (or something ) is in the details. Sometimes I'm not sure what. Detailed planning is just something I fell into early in life. Dad was a terrific planner; he's gone now but my sister and I continue to reap the benefits. I've found that it's much better to plan even though s*** happens. You're better off for it. And you never know what will happen. I believe you make your own luck.

George

[G3750]

George - Seeing your schematic above reminds me I need to run the update for my iPad for the cloud.

Thanks.

Healey

Yeah, I borrowed that "mountain" straight out of a Visio representation of the "cloud".

George