Coronavirus:

[robert.]

Is this the mall that charges $15.00 to park?

[Rufus T. Firefly]

Is this the mall that charges $15.00 to park?

Only when there's an event going on over at the stadium. 33k spaces.....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_ ... eadowlands

Given where things were 1-2 years ago on malls, and all the financial and legal mess, the entire concept was a serious head scratcher....

[MurphOnMillerAve]

Yup. Alas.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

[HONDO74]

[HONDO74]

[HONDO74]

Covid vaccine: How will we keep it cold enough?
https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-54889084

News about the world's first successful trial of a coronavirus vaccine was greeted with jubilation on Monday.

But while there are a number of reasons to remain cautious, there's at least one one big practical hurdle to overcome.

Speaking on Radio 4's Today programme this morning, Health Secretary Matt Hancock spoke of the "mammoth logistical operation" of transporting the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine from its point of manufacture to the arm of the patient.

That's because it cannot be removed from a temperature of -70C (-94F) more than four times.

And that temperature is about four times as cold as the average home freezer.

Most other vaccines do not require anywhere near such low storage temperatures, so there is not a widespread infrastructure already in place.

In its own disclosure notice, Pfizer acknowledges there are "challenges related to our vaccine candidate's ultra-low temperature formulation and attendant storage, distribution and administration requirements".

At the Downing Street press conference on Monday, England's deputy chief medical officer Prof Jonathan Van-Tam warned that even in normal times, "things can and do and have always gone wrong" when it comes to both vaccine manufacture and distribution.

[Neil]

We ship stem cells for transplant all around the world at much colder temperatures (as in liquid nitrogen close to -190 degrees Celsius). Not saying there aren't challenges for larger volumes, but this is wildly overstating the obstacles from people who apparently have little or no experience with products that need even lower temperatures than -70 degrees Celsius. Every transfusion service has -70 or -80 degrees Celsius freezers for plasma and they are very large, probably capable of storing hundreds or even thousands of doses of vaccine. For shipping, dry ice (solid CO2) should work. Making more of them shouldn't be a huge problem, although scaling up volume may take some months. Much ado about nothing .

[Rufus T. Firefly]

We ship stem cells for transplant all around the world at much colder temperatures (as in liquid nitrogen close to -190 degrees Celsius). Not saying there aren't challenges for larger volumes, but this is wildly overstating the obstacles from people who apparently have little or no experience with products that need even lower temperatures than -70 degrees Celsius. Every transfusion service has -70 or -80 degrees Celsius freezers for plasma and they are very large, probably capable of storing hundreds or even thousands of doses of vaccine. For shipping, dry ice (solid CO2) should work. Making more of them shouldn't be a huge problem, although scaling up volume may take some months. Much ado about nothing .

Indeed - much ado about nothing. There must have been 10-15 -80C freezers in the hallway outside my office. And, those are huge and each could easily hold thousands of vials. Pick up the phone and order them.

Dry ice shipping is routine and indicators are also added into such packaging to show temperature integrity.

This is easy; try shipping something difficult.

[HONDO74]

but this is wildly overstating the obstacles from people who apparently have little or no experience with products that need even lower temperatures than -70 degrees Celsius.

Jonathan Van-Tam
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonathan_Van-Tam

Jonathan Stafford Nguyen Van-Tam MBE (born 2 February 1964), also known as JVT, [3] is a British specialist in influenza, including its epidemiology, transmission, vaccinology, antiviral drugs and pandemic preparedness. On 2 October 2017 he took up the role of Deputy Chief Medical Officer for England.

Obviously not as talented a medical genius as Neil.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

but this is wildly overstating the obstacles from people who apparently have little or no experience with products that need even lower temperatures than -70 degrees Celsius.

Jonathan Van-Tam
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jonathan_Van-Tam

Jonathan Stafford Nguyen Van-Tam MBE (born 2 February 1964), also known as JVT, [3] is a British specialist in influenza, including its epidemiology, transmission, vaccinology, antiviral drugs and pandemic preparedness. On 2 October 2017 he took up the role of Deputy Chief Medical Officer for England.

Really then does make you wonder and question why he's grossly overstating things......and probably to make folks keep calm and be patient.

[Neil]

"Obviously not as talented a medical genius as Neil. "

Obviously this MBE knows a lot less about freezing things than Neil or Rufus do . Or is just trying to keep expectations reasonable, as Rufus suggested. Influenza physicians don't have any reason to understand storing and shipping things in the cold. Transfusion medicine physicians/stem cell transplanters like myself do. And whatever Rufus did for a living, he seems to have understood and had experience freezing biological materials.

You could take your grievances about me all the way to the Supreme Court.

The Supreme Court, which is apparently about to stuff those red state scum who are trying to destroy American's health care into a little red basket and ship them home at room temperature . Cynical dogs, just like some here. Looks like these red state dogs and Trump's whimpering mutts will be yelping all the way home with their tails between their legs, since even Alito seems unsympathetic to their nincompoop legal ideas. Not to mention Kavanaugh and Roberts, whose strong comments likely doom this appeal. Got to say I enjoyed listening to them skewering the Texas and Trump lawyers.

[HONDO74]

You could take your grievances about me all the way to the Supreme Court.

I have no grievance with you Neil. Just another one of your hallucinations.

I never was against the ACA. In fact I thought it had a lot of good points. Is it still affordable. for those that bought it ?

What I never figured out was how you democrats put it in the hands of private insurance.

Biden says he wants to improve on it.( I think that's a good idea ) and not go with medicare for all.

It was already established by the supreme court ( John Roberts conservative )that the ACA is here to stay

I don't think he is going to change his opinion on that and he has another conservative that agrees with him

[Rufus T. Firefly]

"Obviously not as talented a medical genius as Neil. "

Obviously this MBE knows a lot less about freezing things than Neil or Rufus do . Or is just trying to keep expectations reasonable, as Rufus suggested. Influenza physicians don't have any reason to understand storing and shipping things in the cold. Transfusion medicine physicians/stem cell transplanters like myself do. And whatever Rufus did for a living, he seems to have understood and had experience freezing biological materials.

Not only freezing biological materials, but shipping around them around the world and then domestically on dry ice. Dry ice was declared a hazardous substance so you have to take a course to be certified to ship stuff with it and be refreshed every so often, too. Couple of hours and some rational common sense and you can be packing up stuff to ship. The paperwork is more problematic than the packing. And, there are far harder and more complicated items to ship that simple biologicals.

[HONDO74]

Really then does make you wonder and question why he's grossly overstating things......and probably to make folks keep calm and be patient.

I have no idea. I'M not a medical expert. I just posted an article that was on the BBC. I didn't know the vaccine had to be kept at such a low temperature.What about the flu vaccine ? I just got my shot yesterday. 1st one I have had in over 20 years. I took your advice and got one this year