.

[RDSRR]

This may help
http://oscale.uberflip.com/i/919472-jan ... 018/37?m4=

[Rufus T. Firefly]

BTW, these Wiseman trucks are quite crappy.
No, seriously crappy!!!
But what did I expect for 20 bucks. Lesson learned!

1/2 the price is the wheelsets; I've used the archbars from Wiseman on/off and prior to his acquisition of that line - not found them to be all that bad but they do take a bit of work. If you want to spend $45+ for trucks to go under a $20 car, have at it!

Rufus, It isn’t always about the money. I’ve mounted a $1500 scope on a $1000 dollar rifle. It’s not the cost, it’s what works and makes you happy.

It is when you don't have it to spend on such stuff.

[E7]

Haven't had time to do much of a response, but here we go.

I won't hide behind "opinion". Grin!

My comment is right there in black and white, nothing is hidden. You can stop grinning.

The fact remains, if you want scale cross-sections in plastic models, you accept and respect some fragility for that fidelity. If we didn't, then cast-on grabs and six-scale-inch thick stirrups would still be the norm. Because of the inability of so many to accept that, they are the norm; look at Atlas Trainman. The HO guys would laugh those things off the planet. They manage their even finer details quite nicely and some of the latest N is exquisite. Yet in big ol' O we have to settle for forty-year-old thought because we can't handle a model? Might as well call it what it is, then and put a big ol' giraffe head bobbing up and down in the middle of the roof.

All the above tripe doesn't have anything to do with what I suggested which was to use metal detail parts to replace some of the flimsier plastic bits. If we check OST #96 you put together a P&D B unit which has brass grabs. I guess it's OK when YOU do it!

I really don't care what the HO guys do and the only "N" I've ever seen with FINE details was brass

The reason Intermountain left was because we did it to ourselves. They, along with Red Caboose and San Juan, gave us beautiful styrene kits and we just beat them up over it. Funny, the Brits have no problem with building and handling them. Thus, they have over a hundred different prototypes available in styrene kit form in O Scale, all domestic made. Mainstream stuff there.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I stopped buying IM kits because of the fragility of the small details. Guess I could have followed my own advice regarding metal add-ons, but that was WAY EARLY on and I didn't know what all was out there.

As far as Red Caboose freight cars, correct me if I'm wrong but seems to me they had metal details????? Like grabs and the rail around the tank??? (Never had any boxcars or flats!)

If the Brits made stuff I liked, I wouldn't hesitate to buy it, but I am about at the end of the buying road.

Finis

[sarge]

The fact remains, if you want scale cross-sections in plastic models, you accept and respect some fragility for that fidelity. If we didn't, then cast-on grabs and six-scale-inch thick stirrups would still be the norm. Because of the inability of so many to accept that, they are the norm; look at Atlas Trainman. The HO guys would laugh those things off the planet. They manage their even finer details quite nicely and some of the latest N is exquisite. Yet in big ol' O we have to settle for forty-year-old thought because we can't handle a model? Might as well call it what it is, then and put a big ol' giraffe head bobbing up and down in the middle of the roof.

All the above tripe doesn't have anything to do with what I suggested which was to use metal detail parts to replace some of the flimsier plastic bits.

No, but perhaps you are mistaking my intent? We're not talking about your suggestion, but moved on to the general state of plastic models in O Scale, and nothing is intended as personal denigration.

The quoted statement has everything to do with why we still have absolutely gross and clunky detail levels in plastic models foisted off on us in the scale world all given a by as "necessary". Why is it germaine rather than tripe? Because you are absolutely correct. People won't buy because detail is delicate, or so the marketers tell us and we listen to it, nod, and buy crap that holds up well to, say, bluebox Athearn from fifty years ago, because that is what is served up. Meanwhile fidelity marches on in the smaller scales as mainstream.

If we check OST #96 you put together a P&D B unit which has brass grabs. I guess it's OK when YOU do it!

Finis

No, it has nothing to do with me, and a bit rude.

Its because that is what Pat put in the box. First, it was a review, and second, though I can deal just fine with IM detail delicateness, if they had put castings in I'd not be so foolish as to go seeking out weaker ones unless those supplied castings were gross. Then, you're dam right I most certainly would.

For the moment, "Finis", is right. Give me an hour and I'll be grinning again.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

...........we still have absolutely gross and clunky detail levels in plastic models foisted off on us in the scale world all given a by as "necessary"......................People won't buy because detail is delicate, or so the marketers tell us and we listen to it, nod, and buy crap .....

Yes A goodly part of that is maintained by the people continuing to embrace the mythology of "too fragile" in O scale and that fine detail can only be done in while worshiping at the brass altar, and as a result then you must accept the compromises in plastic that we choose to sell you.....

Then again, some folks can't be bothered figure out how to pick up car properly, can't figure out that it's not suitable for playing basketball, or can't figure out how to transport their models w/o being clumsy ham-handed gimboids......

And then when we get good plastic models, they end up going the way of the dodo bird.

Meanwhile fidelity marches on in the smaller scales as mainstream.

Indeed it does......

[Robert]

It almost ironic for me...since I migrated from HO scale into O scale in pursuit of it's greater detailing potential.

Robert

...........we still have absolutely gross and clunky detail levels in plastic models foisted off on us in the scale world all given a by as "necessary"......................People won't buy because detail is delicate, or so the marketers tell us and we listen to it, nod, and buy crap .....

And then when we get good plastic models, they end up going the way of the dodo bird.

Meanwhile fidelity marches on in the smaller scales as mainstream.

Indeed it does......

Robert

[E7]

I think one thing we will all concur is there is no point flogging this horse any further......at least I am done for certain.

[Rufus T. Firefly]