Mexican EMC F2's

[Carey Williams]

Hello all you may enjoy seeing the EMC F2's made in Mexico by A.D Lara & Deses.
Yes very close to the Atwater/ GMC / All Nation F3's ...both die-cast.
Commonly found built for center third rail...but a few out there are 2 rail. Beautifully designed mechanics for easy swapping out of parts and lubrication.

Being all die-cast ...when good very good ..but when bad just awful.
Powered unit straight as an arrow...dummy body waving ( but none of the hair cracks ) ..one truck castings toast ... fortunate to have a friend with nos replacement piece.

Known paint schemes Nacionales de Mexico early and late ...also Santa Fe War Bonnet .
Dates made ? Different source state 1950's other 60's.
Anyone know first use of the Green & Orange N de M scheme ? ( Earliest I found on line was 1965)

Please see link for video

https://youtu.be/xCFq1kBkOwA


Cheers Carey

[De Bruin]

Love these Carey! They look great too, I understand they might have similiarity to the AMT/KMT F units? True or is that just "Kalmbach-ery?"
I have an Atwater F unit in my queue awaiting paint and decals that John Fisher had modified with the F2 details.
Can't get enough NdeM or FCP or ChP for that matter. Fascinating.

[Carey Williams]

Hello Pete
Deses very close to Atwater units .
AMT /KMT / Kusan...I always thought much closer to Lionel than scale ...just my opinion...

Need to find more original info about the Deses pieces ...

Cheers Carey

[webenda]

Thank you Carey. That was very interesting. I did not know about Deses. I think the date on his units might be 6209 (September 1962.)
Leonard Williams can pronounce Hecho any way he wants to. I pronounce Hecho like this, eh - choh.

The pronunciation of words depends on where you live. Since I moved to Kentucky, several people have told me that my pronunciation of English is wrong.

[De Bruin]

......Anyone know first use of the Green & Orange N de M scheme ? ( Earliest I found on line was 1965)

Sorry for the delay Carey, I have collected a lot of NdeM photo's off the interweb, private collections, springing for virtually anything in print, books or periodicals etc and so without being definitive, the earliest photo in my pile wearing that NdeM Scarlet and Dark Green is a Matt Herson shot of an FP-9 dated March 5, 1963, he includes another shot of an FP-9 on the same date and location(Lecheria) still sporting the earlier (quite attractive) dark green, yellow and coral factory scheme too. So take it for what it's worth, there's likely a date of introduction that's earlier out there, but I have no idea when that happened.
Kudos again on those Deses units, soooo.... cool, I regret having watched a few of those pass on Ebay over the years without biting because they were three rail.
Pete

[Carey Williams]

Hello Pete and Wayne

Thank you for your input

So the Sept 1962 .(6209...on fuel tank casting ) ..would nicely dove tail into the first
( known) use of this paint scheme.

Many moons ago Deses was selling off the engines and parts at a train show ....
A friend purchased several items at the time ....he was very kind to send a truck casting to replace the one that had gone south due to zinc pest .....on the dummy unit.

Converting 3 to 2 rail would be very easy ....you can pull the wheel sets out in under 5 minutes .

Just be cautious of castings .......once they start going bad no turning back .

Cheers Carey

[bob turner]

The Atwater/All Nation F3s do not have a reputation of warping or disintegrating. As far as I can tell, they are pretty much equivalent to the Deses except that they may be not as heavy. Deses improved the windshield, but not by much.

As an owner of an A-B-A UP set and an A-A SP set of Atwaters, I have always been happy - but Maroon sent me some brass/bronze castings that I like a lot better, due to the feeling that they will never, ever, ever disintegrate. They may come unsoldered, and some crazy guy in 2079 may have to re-solder them, but they are here forever.



Yes I have posted these elsewhere, and yes, they await a more sophisticated paint job, but I really like them.
I think I have an Atwater photo in the Shutterfly:

[bob turner]

With permission, here are Carey's images.





I will get Retro's permission to post his ACL FTs here as well.

Note the striking color scheme - almost as good as Warbonnet!

[bob turner]

As promised, Retro's FT:



With permission.
We have decided that this set is simply a scratchbuild, using Adams castings for nose and roof. The rivet battens on the sides are exquisite, yet indicate that each rivet was hand-punched. Very unlike Wentzco or any other early FT model. You can see through the screens.

I have some better photos, but I would have to put them in Shutterfly to copy them here - MTJ needs a host.

[bob turner]

This one, too, is in Retro's collection. It is a more common Adams FT.

[bob turner]

Finally, here is Carey's Wentzco FT - note that this one is of value only for its historical interest - crude, even by Adams standards.

[Carey Williams]

Hello everyone.. Bob Thank you for transferring the photos .

Yes the Wentzco FT have a bit of an odd profile ...Wentz made his engines a bit too tall and narrow ...close counts .

Yes Atwater / GMC / All Nation F units ....never have seen a bad casting .....the gentlemen who owns the company now has a A& B set polished up like a mirror that he displays at the March meet ...they look stunning!

Cheers Carey