Doorstop with Unusual Aftermarket Drive

[R.K. Maroon]

I picked up a Ken-Kraft (a.k.a Ken Krayer) Alco FA/FB pair on eBay last week. These were available with drives from the factory but I have never seen one with an original drive in it. Part of my interest in this pair was a bottom photo of the A unit, which showed a drive that I did not recognize (and hoped was the elusive original). It arrived today and I didn't waste anytime in pulling the drive out. Here it is:



Now that it is dug out of there I know what it is, but it was not obvious to me from the bottom shot. And it's certainly not what I expected.

And the answer is......???

[ScaleCraft]

That is really easy to identify if you've seen them before.
Lionel.
F unit.
But specifically first (non magnetraction version) of 2333, identifiable from the flat fibre brush plate and finned brush holders (2343's had A) magnetraction and B) bakelite end plate with integral brush holders).
The side mounts for the sideframes have been ground almost fully off, scale wheels installed, truck is turned around from Lionel mounting, the coupler mount is now forward with mounting steel plate ears removed, small selenium rectumfrier mounted on top.
Nice units....tower drive on the end with an idler gear, driving a steel gear on the jackshaft with worms milled into the shaft, and brass worm gears.
Parts source when you put a newer drive in it.
Motor comes off with two screws under the rectumfrier, then the top plate that had the king pin comes off with two short screws on the other end under the motors, then lift the jackshaft up from the geared and and out.
Not sure from the photos how this truck was mounted...I see bosses in the shell for the pivot plate, but no plate....and nothing bridging the field on top.
Dave

[R.K. Maroon]

Dave is correct. From what I read, this original Lionel F3 drive last only a year or two (~1949-50) before they added magnetraction. Not long after that they redesigned the whole drive to the ubiquitous vertical motor configuration:



This looks like a well engineered, "not cheap" design:



Arthur Hayes has a Lionel F3 set with this drive converted to two-rail (actually outside third-rail) and he says these horizontal drives have a great growl to them -- "best sounding drive Lionel ever made". I would have thought that many would have recognized this drive, but I guess there are fewer Lionel converts among us then I thought. I will admit that I didn't know it either, but did some online research and figured it out. Oh, and I was aided by the "Lionel" marking in the casting.

[ScaleCraft]

I have several...a "bunch"...of 2343's.....and you don't need a sound system...nor do you need to worry about settling in ballast before you secure it. Run a couple of these around two or three times.....it will shake the ballast down nice and neat.
I have a chassis milled to match a milled cast bronze FT that doesn't need MagneTraction...the sucker is HEAVY!

[Rufus T. Firefly]

I picked up a Ken-Kraft (a.k.a Ken Krayer) Alco FA/FB pair on eBay last week.

What's one of these shells weigh,

[R.K. Maroon]

A table found on Page 22 of the March/April Issue of O Scale Trains gives the weight of the Ken Krayer (Ken-Kraft) FA that is shown in the accompanying article as 6.8 pounds. That particular FA has an all-wheel CLW drive in it. I would guess the shell is about four pounds.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

A table found on Page 22 of the March/April Issue of O Scale Trains gives the weight of the Ken Krayer (Ken-Kraft) FA that is shown in the accompanying article as 6.8 pounds. That particular FA has an all-wheel CLW drive in it. I would guess the shell is about four pounds.

Hmmmm........I'm thinking that the KK shell tha tI tested the heft of in Indy might have been something else then - though it was quite a bit heavier...... Then again, as my daughter reminds me reguarly, "Your old!".

[bob turner]

Five pounds, 13 ounces. That is an FA with Kemtron trucks, steel wheels, and brass plates where the trucks bolt. It also includes four pieces of 1/4" square brass soldered to the carbody for truck mounting. No paint, motor, gears, handrails, no nothing. Scale is digital thing we use for mailing stuff. It always matches e UPS weight.

[R.K. Maroon]

So Dave asked the question of how this was mounted. This model has genuine Ken-Kraft frame bolsters. Here is a photo of the rear one removed:



This piece is just the right thickness to fit in between the motor shaft housing and the lower gear case of the Lionel Drive:



There is no king pin. The weight of the shell rests through frame bolster onto the truck lower gear case. As such, the truck has a small amount of lateral play. The frame bolster has been cut down a bit to allow for swivel. Not how I would do it, but I think it might actually work OK.

It is against my modeling ethic to have unpowered B-units. As such I will set the Lionel drive aside on this set and install CLW drives instead -- I have three sets of what I believe to be CLW FA drives sitting in the parts inventory (where they have been patiently waiting for assignment). And I have another A-unit, so this set is targeted to become a fully powered ABA set. I may not keep it PRR though......or I might. The paint and striping on these was done reasonably well and I think it can be resurrected with touch up. The only problem then would be getting the second A-unit to match. Decisions, decisions.

The Lionel drive will go into the inventory. I think it would be interesting to see it installed and running in some suitable locomotive.

Jim

[R.K. Maroon]

OK -- last bump of the evening. No great thing here but I may actually finish this project someday. OK, not someday soon, but I haven't given up on it yet ("Giving up it" means its going to a friend or up on eBay).

Jim