Another interesting item...........

[Jay Criswell]

Peter,

The purpose wasn't the use of plastic centers. I believe it was to improve a drive and have all the resistance placed on the gears and drive train. Similar to Lionel in that the rods are just along for the ride and play no role in actually doing any of the work. No wear & tear on rods or crank pins.

Done properly it would work fine. There is no appreciable noise in a well designed and executed gearbox. Some concern themselves with the additional resistance of every axle having a gear box.....dosen't seem to bother any of the diesel models I've run.

Jay

[Nortonville Phil]

Here is what looks like the Walthers Streamlined Hudson.
http://clintjefferies.com/images/1237m.jpg

[Carey Williams]

Hello Phil

Thank you very much for pointing the direction .
Cheers Carey

[ScaleCraft]

Peter,

The purpose wasn't the use of plastic centers. I believe it was to improve a drive and have all the resistance placed on the gears and drive train. Similar to Lionel in that the rods are just along for the ride and play no role in actually doing any of the work. No wear & tear on rods or crank pins.

Done properly it would work fine. There is no appreciable noise in a well designed and executed gearbox. Some concern themselves with the additional resistance of every axle having a gear box.....dosen't seem to bother any of the diesel models I've run.

Jay

My recollection on these is decades and decades old. Plastic was to insulate...cheaply....and you are correct about "Done properly it would work fine"....except we are talking about Walthers here.

Again, old recollections...the gearboxes were not done "properly". Could you run them in with Ipana toothpaste and clean, then lube, and have some semblance of quiet?
Yes.

I am going to go out on a limb here...but...I think every one of these I have ever seen (including mine) was converted to different cast drivers, single gearbox, functioning rods.

Again on the recollections...I never, ever had anyone tell me these were wonderful quiet, reliable performers.

Maybe with a lot of work....but they also told me the gears sucked, and with three or four axles worth of the inverse of "Done properly it would work fine", they got converted.

I won't own one. No time to try to rework them (altho NWSL boxes might just make a world of difference...as long as the couplings between gearboxes never, ever move).

[herronpeter]

Thanks for that info Jay and you're right, diesel locomotives do have a gear box per axle (with some exceptions). Based on my experience with older brass (not a whole lot compared to most hete) and based on the photos, I was thinking along the lines of Scale Craft's post.

Are you anywhere near those fires out there? Hope not............

Merry Christmas.......

Peter

[E7]

Here is what looks like the Walthers Streamlined Hudson.
http://clintjefferies.com/images/1237m.jpg

Looks like it was inspired by Brio!

[rrjjf]

Yes,

O scale diesels do have have gear on each axle but they do not have side rods that must be in quarter. Getting the gears to mesh on each axle with the quartered side rods can be a task without leaving a good bit of slop in the side rod crankpin holes. I have never owned a poly drive mechanism but I read many years ago they did not work all that well once you got past 3 driver axles. It was a clever concept but the material used were not up to the concept in my opinion. As far as I know only Walthers ever offered locos made with this modular concept. If it was such a success others would have copied it or something like it.

Unless there was some way to lengthen the space between the poly drive modules I don't know how a loco with 80" drivers would fit into modules spaced for 63" or smaller drivers.

Joe

[bob turner]

A lousy idea, in my opinion. Side rods work just fine, on the real thing and on models. We strive (at least I do) for the most inobtrusive gearing, messing up the looks of a good main frame on only a single axle.

Walthers' idea sucked, which is why it never caught on. It was ugly, difficult to set up, and difficult to maintain. Even the Lionel scheme - spur gears on the back of the drivers - was unnecessary and ugly, although it worked better.

Opinion.

[Jay Criswell]

I'll bet you two I can do it and it will run fine. Care to put some money on it?

I will have my 1:1 ball bearing gearboxes on each axle and a Pittman or Faulhaber gear head motor mounted in the boiler with a drop down in the firebox.

You say it's a lousy idea but you've never done it.

Jay

[Rufus T. Firefly]

I'll bet you two I can do it and it will run fine. Care to put some money on it?

Now you have our attention!

[John Webster]

Is this for an x-8-x wheel arrangement? Rigid frame or sprung drive axles? Should there be a curve radius requirement? Would a cell phone video with sound of the mechanism running on 1.25" 2 rail track be sufficient proof of success?

Would we spectators be allowed to place side bets?

I've been looking for an HO Walthers polydrive 0-6-0 for my switch engine collection for years.

[Jay Criswell]

That would be like rules in a knife fight.

Jay

[bob turner]

Well, my rules would include no visual non-locomotive stuff visible from the side, sprung drivers, and at least as good performance as a similar mechanism with a single gearbox. And an impartial judge. I will put $50 in escrow on that. If Jay succeeds, it will be a worthy contribution toward his efforts.

It won't completely cover it, though. I think good gearboxes are pushing $60 each, which, regardless of success, would render this commercially unsound.

[Jay Criswell]

Visual drive.....................though it probably won't be, irrelevant

Sprung drivers.................most likely but, irrelevant

Performance as good as a traditional drive, agreed. I think my standards are higher than most.

Impartial judge...............guess we'll have to go through some sort of nominating process and a vote from all parties involved.

Commercial viability..................irrelevant.

$50???? come on where's you confidence level that this is all just a folly? How about a hundred, a grand?

I already have a frame SP MK-4 (54" drivers), the gearboxes (1:1 ball bearing), a nice little Faulhaber gear head.

Again, saying it's a lousy idea or it won't work if you've never seen or worked on one is cheating yourself of the opportunity to learn.

Jay

[John Webster]

Sprung drivers raises the degree of difficulty considerably. It will require multi piece side rods. It will probably require some mechanisms to keep the gearboxes from rotating.