Coronavirus:

[Neil]

Thanks, it only took 30-40 years . Credit to the editor who was willing to go against the dogma in favor of the data, and ignore the reviewers' quibbling about this or that, which always happens when you overthrow expert opinion and religious faith in same.

[HONDO74]

And 70 million Americans were wrong last November .

I have done my best to keep politics out of this thread so that just the intellectuals aspects could be discussed. I asked for opinions on that not a bunch of political opinions. you are entitled to your opinions, but so am I and others that disagree with you.

In this country we have people that are too stupid, lazy or ignorant to take personal responsibility for themselves. Always blaming someone else for their mistakes and wanting others to take care of them.

I don't care what Trump or Biden say. I am the one that is responsible for me.

[Neil]

"you are entitled to your opinions, but so am I and others that disagree with you."

Of course. I answered your questions on the science. The election was relevant to the public health issues I addressed. You are not in a great position to criticize someone else for introducing a political issue into a scientific discussion . Try cutting others as much slack as you allow yourself. The moral high ground you seem to be claiming is a pretty slippery slope.

[HONDO74]

"you are entitled to your opinions, but so am I and others that disagree with you."

Of course. I answered your questions on the science. The election was relevant to the public health issues I addressed. You are not in a great position to criticize someone else for introducing a political issue into a scientific discussion . Try cutting others as much slack as you allow yourself. The moral high ground you seem to be claiming is a pretty slippery slope.

So lets go back to the intellectuals aspects of the article. I did take the time to read the whole thing and found it rather interesting. What happens if they can't come up with how it started. Will we get hit with another pandemic.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

Thanks, it only took 30-40 years . Credit to the editor who was willing to go against the dogma in favor of the data, and ignore the reviewers' quibbling about this or that, which always happens when you overthrow expert opinion and religious faith in same.

Too few Editors are willing to exhibit spine and take a stand vs. reviewers. Experiencing what goes on behind the curtain over on Editorial side of publishing is highly illuminating for those in the publishing arena.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

What happens if they can't come up with how it started. Will we get hit with another pandemic.

I don't expect that those 2 questions are actually or necessarily linked.

They spend time and resources chasing down a past event in hopes of understanding how a future one might present.

Almost assuredly. What sort and when and from what source is tbd.

[Neil]

Sure, if it is found that most likely the original virus strain came from a research or clinical lab, that would be important because we can learn from it. If it is found that it probably came from someone's pet animal, that will also be important. But most likely things will remain quite fuzzy. We do know that human beings co-habiting with farm or wild animals is a bad idea in terms of epidemics. And that wild animals living in our residential structures (e.g., rats) is a bad idea. These have been known for decades to a century.

If it's a lab source, that leads to another set of safety issues, including security, oversight, etc. One way or the other, viruses will keep jumping from animals to humans until we stop co-habiting with them in places like China and Africa where this is standard operating procedure, and until we stop exploring wild environments without appropriate consideration of contagion. Difficult problems with no simple solutions.

[HONDO74]

What happens if they can't come up with how it started. Will we get hit with another pandemic.

I don't expect that those 2 questions are actually or necessarily linked.

They spend time and resources chasing down a past event in hopes of understanding how a future one might present.

Almost assuredly. What sort and when and from what source is tbd.

Since China is being uncooperative with the investigation it looks like we will never know. If this virus did start in Wuhan and this lab is located there, I guess that was just a coincidence

[Rufus T. Firefly]

.............viruses will keep jumping from animals to humans until we stop co-habiting with them in places like China and Africa ........

We have plenty of animals co-habiting with humans in the US. Nobody gives it a thought until something happens.....

[HONDO74]

.............viruses will keep jumping from animals to humans until we stop co-habiting with them in places like China and Africa ........

We have plenty of animals co-habiting with humans in the US. Nobody gives it a thought until something happens.....

Are you talking about pets like dogs and cats or other animals. farm animals/wild animals ?

[Neil]

I was referring to the latter, farm and wild animals. Most Americans, whether farmers or not, do not have, on average, the same level of contact with domesticated food sources and wild animals as people living in closer to subsistence economies.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

.............viruses will keep jumping from animals to humans until we stop co-habiting with them in places like China and Africa ........

We have plenty of animals co-habiting with humans in the US. Nobody gives it a thought until something happens.....

Are you talking about pets like dogs and cats or other animals. farm animals/wild animals ?

Generally farm animals that folks have regular close contact with (not your larger or corporate farms); folks round my area in Pa have chickens running wild (actually we're allowed to keep chickens right here, ); goats and horses penned in right adjacent to the house; some years ago the one neighbor kept a full size pig that was regularly in/out of the house. Then there are the folks that keep "exotic" animals and pets.....

[HONDO74]

Big cats, bears, ferrets get COVID-19 vaccine at Oakland Zoo
https://www.ky3.com/2021/07/04/big-cats ... kland-zoo/

OAKLAND, Calif. (AP) — A San Francisco Bay Area zoo is inoculating its big cats, bears and ferrets against the coronavirus as part of a national effort to protect animal species using an experimental vaccine.

Tigers Ginger and Molly were the first two animals at the Oakland Zoo to get the vaccine this week, the San Francisco Chronicle reported Saturday. The doses were donated and developed by veterinary pharmaceutical company Zoetis in New Jersey.

Alex Herman, vice president of veterinary services at the zoo, said none of the animals have gotten the virus, but they wanted to be proactive. Tigers, black and grizzly bears, mountain lions and ferrets were the first to receive the first of two doses. Next are primates and pigs.

In a press release, she said the zoo has used barriers for social distancing and staff have worn protective gear to protect susceptible species. “We’re happy and relieved to now be able to better protect our animals with this vaccine,” she said.

[NJPiney]

This isn't all that complicated. Nature cures overpopulation in one or both of two ways: Starvation and/or disease. We are an arrogant species that continually thinks it's immune to the laws of nature and we are continually proven wrong.

[Rufus T. Firefly]

This isn't all that complicated. Nature cures overpopulation in one or both of two ways: Starvation and/or disease. We are an arrogant species that continually thinks it's immune to the laws of nature and we are continually proven wrong.

"History shows again and again how nature points up the folly of men"