Sneak Peak: Preliminary track plan for PRR Panhandle 2.0

[G3750]

It'll be operational,

Back in 2009, I took my Open Hearth (complete with operating smokestacks and power supply) to an NMRA division meeting.

The HO members were not happy because I was polluting the air.

I didn't get a single vote at the "Bring N Brag". (Yes, it was a vast HO conspiracy!!!! )

George

Susquehanna Division?

Keystone Division.

[G3750]

Back in 2009, I took my Open Hearth (complete with operating smokestacks and power supply) to an NMRA division meeting.

The HO members were not happy because I was polluting the air.
George

Protosmoke will do that to people.

Wrong. My Open Hearth is built with Lionel Industrial Smokestacks 6-14142. Two of them.

6-14142_1550.jpg (24.32 KiB) Viewed 4712 times

George

[Steamfan77]

George,

Great track plan for the new layout. You've put a lot of thought into this. Great operations, ample access, and the visual interest in both buildings and scenery will be pure eye candy. Can't wait to see it come to life. I hope you document this layout as much as the current layout, it's fun to follow along. As far as layout height, just my two cents, my lower level is about 43" and the upper level is 52". I like the action better at that height (I'm 6'3"), and will occasionally have a seat on a high stool, which brings the action even closer. I know Healey said he's 6'4", and he prefers the layout lower. I just think it boils down to what you prefer. I'm not an expert by any means, but I'm glad that I went with L girder for the benchwork. if you check my Long Island thread out I built the benchwork without any help, and in sections. It went together quickly and is very strong. I did use 3/4" sub roadbed. And I've discovered that if you have a joist in the way you can easily move it. That's why I secured the sub roadbed from underneath. Just remove a few screws, move the joist, and fasten it in its new home. I didn't have rip out a bunch of benchwork, track, or scenery (thankfully). I thought long and hard about what style benchwork I'd use, and I'm glad I chose L girder using 3/4" birch ply for all components.

Andy

[Rufus T. Firefly]

Back in 2009, I took my Open Hearth (complete with operating smokestacks and power supply) to an NMRA division meeting.

The HO members were not happy because I was polluting the air.

I didn't get a single vote at the "Bring N Brag". (Yes, it was a vast HO conspiracy!!!! )

George

Susquehanna Division?

Keystone Division.

Ah, not the Region you actually live in then,

[G3750]

Susquehanna Division?

Keystone Division.

Ah, not the Region you actually live in then,

Actually, I joined the NMRA in Pittsburgh in 1997. And I still have friends there in the Keystone Division.

But yeah, the HO folks are not enthusiastic regarding smoke - it dirties their scenery and rails.

I don't think I've ever seen an HO model railroader without a Britebar in his hand.

George

[G3750]

George,

Great track plan for the new layout. You've put a lot of thought into this. Great operations, ample access, and the visual interest in both buildings and scenery will be pure eye candy. Can't wait to see it come to life. I hope you document this layout as much as the current layout, it's fun to follow along. As far as layout height, just my two cents, my lower level is about 43" and the upper level is 52". I like the action better at that height (I'm 6'3"), and will occasionally have a seat on a high stool, which brings the action even closer. I know Healey said he's 6'4", and he prefers the layout lower. I just think it boils down to what you prefer. I'm not an expert by any means, but I'm glad that I went with L girder for the benchwork. if you check my Long Island thread out I built the benchwork without any help, and in sections. It went together quickly and is very strong. I did use 3/4" sub roadbed. And I've discovered that if you have a joist in the way you can easily move it. That's why I secured the sub roadbed from underneath. Just remove a few screws, move the joist, and fasten it in its new home. I didn't have rip out a bunch of benchwork, track, or scenery (thankfully). I thought long and hard about what style benchwork I'd use, and I'm glad I chose L girder using 3/4" birch ply for all components.

Andy

Thank you Andy.

I do plan to document this layout's construction on line.

The current layout is assembled from "tables" of butt-joint segments bolted together. I've never tried L girder, but I may have to look into it.

George

[Rufus T. Firefly]

Keystone Division.

Ah, not the Region you actually live in then,

Actually, I joined the NMRA in Pittsburgh in 1997. And I still have friends there in the Keystone Division.

I do get out there now & again, but not recently. I've generally found that there's more active O scale NMRA members out there though.....generally I'm all alone in our own Region at conventions,

But yeah, the HO folks are not enthusiastic regarding smoke - it dirties their scenery and rails.

I don't think I've ever seen an HO model railroader without a Britebar in his hand.

George

Yeah, they have this tiny track that the slightest imperfection tosses everything silly.

[G3750]

I do get out there now & again, but not recently. I've generally found that there's more active O scale NMRA members out there though.....generally I'm all alone in our own Region at conventions,

Yes, but the Keystone Division has a great bunch of folks. Generally accepting of 3-rail. And their division is blessed with some truly great 3 rail modelers, e.g. Neal Schorr.

Yeah, they have this tiny track that the slightest imperfection tosses everything silly.

I was invited to an operating session in Steubenville a few years back and these poor folks (8-9 guys) spent the evening cleaning rails and running trains for 2-6 feet. Lather, rinse, repeat. Crazy, but I did get to operate using DCC. DCC is susceptible to dirty track, but otherwise is very functional. Unlike DCS.

George

[Rufus T. Firefly]

I was invited to an operating session in Steubenville a few years back and these poor folks (8-9 guys) spent the evening cleaning rails and running trains for 2-6 feet. Lather, rinse, repeat. Crazy, but I did get to operate using DCC. DCC is susceptible to dirty track, but otherwise is very functional. Unlike DCS.

I've had DCC operating sessions go both ways in HO. 3 hr sessions that spend 2+ hours fiddling with the DCC and track, or 3 hr with zero issues.

[Steamfan77]

George,

The two books I used are: Basic Model Railroad Benchwork by Jeff Wilson, and How to Build Model Railroad Benchwork (2nd edition) by Linn Westcott. Both are published by Kalmbach books. They are excellent references. If you have any questions, I'd be happy to help.

Andy

[gnnpnut]

Well I'll contribute to thread drift.

You O scalers are hanging around with the wrong HO crowd.

I cleaned my whole HO layout after sitting for over six years during construction. Funny thing was, it still ran, but there were a few areas acting up. When I was running regular proto-op sessions , I didn't clean any track for over five years! I did track oil, and I'm going to try giving up on that, as I don't like the amount of gunk I seem to be accumulating on my rolling stock wheels (all of them metal). I'm planning on securing another two Centerline track cleaning cars for a consist of three cars), so that I can coat the first car roller with denatured alcohol, and the following two cars with dry rollers so soak up the deposits. When I track oiled, I applied light machine oil to the centerline roller pads.

I just got through changing couplers on 22 Proto 2000 freight cars from the crap Kadee knockoffs to Kadee #5s. At the same time, I cleaned the wheels. I was pulling off caked up dirt with my knife like chips on a lathe. Instead of getting hollow wear in the thread, and high flange like the real thing, I get low flange from all the crap caked up on the tread.

I actually find that the HO works far better than three rail O from a track cleanliness standpoint (even discounting the poor DCS performance that will result from less than pristine track). Three rail has one big disadvantage. There are only rollers, with tiny contact patches for the center rail. Two rollers per locomotive, maybe four. Locomotive weight becomes inconsequential too, as the only force on the roller to the rail is from the spring.

When I was doing the modular gig, we ended up having to clean the track at least once a day, usually twice, or we started having engines acting up (yes, even running TMCC). The center rail was the big culprit, keep that clean, and life was good (as long as the TMCC signal didn't take a powder). We usually used cloth rags and denatured alcohol. Some of the guys like to use 600 grit emery paper, I was not a big fan unless the track (gargraves or Ross) rusted. Emery paper leaves micro scratches, and the dirt likes to accumulate in the scratches.

One of the best track cleaners I have found if you have to use a hand held device is a simple piece of 1/4" masonite (the shiny side). Good enough to clean just about any dirty track.

Two rail O scalers should have it far better that HO, but those who operate in HO learned the same tricks from O scalers; wipers on the backs of pickup wheels, and do everything we can for all wheel pickup. All of my brass steam are in the process of getting this upgrade, pc board strips on both sides of the driver, and phosphor bronze wiper wires on the back of the drivers.

With a couple of exceptions on switches that I still have not wired power to the insulated frogs, I simply do not have dead spots on my HO railroad.

I just did a three hour operating session, ran seven mainline trains, three locals, and the yard, and no reported dead spots, and only a couple of derailments in the yard ( ballast between the points and the stock rail).

I loved my time in O scale (albeit in three rail), but going back to HO has been a very pleasant experience, and the home HO railroad is far more reliable than three rail was on even its best day. And this is said not even factoring DCS into the equation.

This doesn't mean that I still don't long for doing a two rail O scale layout, but I doubt I will ever have the time, ambition, or funds to do that, and the HO gig too. A man has got to know his limitations.

Thanks for letting us hy-jack your thread George.

Regards,
Jerry

[G3750]

Well I'll contribute to thread drift.

Thanks for letting us hy-jack your thread George.

Regards,
Jerry

Jerry, thread drift around here is like a slow-motion train wreck.

You just got to stay out of the way.

George

[G3750]

George,

The two books I used are: Basic Model Railroad Benchwork by Jeff Wilson, and How to Build Model Railroad Benchwork (2nd edition) by Linn Westcott. Both are published by Kalmbach books. They are excellent references. If you have any questions, I'd be happy to help.

Andy

Andy, I have the Westcott book. Probably time for a re-read.

George

[Rufus T. Firefly]

George,

I look at your track plan vs. access openings and I have to ask just how long your arms are and how far you can comfortably reach and handle stuff - the 2 are not necessarily the same length. How big an engine can you pick up at full extension of either arm while also avoiding crushing scenery, etc. between the opening and the end objective?

I have a sizeable lift-out (an entire scene) on my layout to let me access a distant corner - that gets me there. That was years ago, and now I'm not confident that I can lift it out w/o hurting the scene or me!

[G3750]

George,

I look at your track plan vs. access openings and I have to ask just how long your arms are and how far you can comfortably reach and handle stuff - the 2 are not necessarily the same length. How big an engine can you pick up at full extension of either arm while also avoiding crushing scenery, etc. between the opening and the end objective?

I have a sizeable lift-out (an entire scene) on my layout to let me access a distant corner - that gets me there. That was years ago, and now I'm not confident that I can lift it out w/o hurting the scene or me!

Great point. I will revisit those.

Thanks,

George