Alco PA and FA 2023

[J. S. Bach]

Very nice, all of them.

[De Bruin]

Yeah Bob, those Krayer FA's are cool! excellent castings aside moresoe to me because they're FA1's, unlike the more prolifically manufactured/modeled FA2.
I have have two of them and enjoy weighing what scheme I'd finish them in. Putting good drives in them is another issue too.
Right now I'm leaning towards the original factory maroon and cream Tennessee Central though rendering decals for that nose herald would be a serious project or expense.
Alternately the New Haven's later black and orange Alpert-scheme is a favorite too. I think both had the dynamic grid like the Krayer casting so no surgery required. (Not easy to remove per Jim's tribulations with early CLW PA's either)

[bob turner]

For the FA I think the B&O, GN, L&N, and probably Tennessee Central would be elegant. Callie Graphics did my nose decal for the Erie-Built, so I suppose she could do anything in vinyl for around $30.

I was sort of hoping Jim would cut in my windshield, but I shall try here. The DRGW photo is for educational purposes, but it is a copyright photo found in Jim Boyd's book "The Alco PAs" - Morning Sun.

Let's try a comparison:

[bob turner]

I shall repeat my "noses" just for kicks. Hey, not much else is going on! I note even OGR has two day old material.


Sure - you can see a slight "widow's peak" on the prototype, but even MTH exaggerated it. Lionel got it just about right. Amazingly, Lionel has been rolling out some really accurate stuff over the last quarter-century. All you have to do is change the wheels and couplers.

Opinion.

[R.K. Maroon]

Note for the record that these cast FAs are Ken Kraft models. The Ken in Ken Kraft is not Ken Krayer but Kenneth Rupp, as seen on this letterhead:



Ken Krayer was not involved in the company but his uncle Ed Krayer was -- Ken was a young man at the time, but did have his own cast model company some twenty years later: Penn-Erie, which made cast-aluminum models, sold directly and through LWS.

Note also that Pearce Tool picked up the cast FA after Ken Kraft folded.

Here is my favorite set of Ken Kraft FAs, built and finished by the late Fred Bradley of Lake Kiowa, Texas:

[bob turner]

I should have remembered that from your previous posts. I guess the "Krayer" part sticks in my brain, to the disadvantage of accuracy in my posts.

Yes, those are really nice. Add GM&O to my list of really good FA paint schemes. I am sure we can add others.

[De Bruin]

Yeah same here, they still blur together in my weak brain.
Note the Ken Kraft FA's have a better windshield shape for the Alco-GE prototype then the second version CLW's
I recall seeing a second version CLW PA AB pair for sale at the "original Whistle Stop" in Pasadena CA around 2000 where the previous owner had soldiered or torched in some "metal meat" on the upper "lip" of the windshield on the A and then very carefully shaped (likely filed) it flat. Not quite right but better looking than the original curvature/arch, as my eye ignored the resulting thicker upper "brow" on favor of the better windshield shape.
Pricey, nicely and accurately done in the UP scheme too. I was still cash poor back then or I might have bought them anyway.

I now have one of these too, just an A unit and was thinking either LV, MP or GM&O.

[bob turner]

There are at least two books covering the PA in the "Morning Sun/ Four Ways West" genre. Anybody aware of a similar book for the FA?

Here is this morning's contribution - sand cast CLW, but with an Alclad coating of "Stainless:"



Those are Lionel PA trucks, powered by Joe Foehrkolb for 2-rail.

[bob turner]

Unable to find an FA all color book, but found lots of photos on the Google. Here is my list:
Great Northern and B&O - my top favorites
GM&O - #2
Mo Pac - #3
Then, in no particular order, I like Soo, CNW, Lehigh Valley, New haven orange, NYC, maybe SP&S. UP is stunning, of course, but there are way too many Armor Yellow Diesels around here.

This got me going - I promise, if I could simply buy Scale Coat, I would do the GMO on a pair of these things. I can do B&O with Dupli-Color, in stock, but I don't get the same precision as I do with an air brush.

https://ogrforum.ogaugerr.com/topic/alc ... ead?page=1

alco fa photos

[R.K. Maroon]

My roster is mostly filled with older domestic models or custom builds, so this ABA set of Overland PAs is something of an outlier:



I acquired the lead AB set in a trade for this Overland ex-N&W Y3a:



I was intending to sell the Y3a but a friend was interested and offered the PAs in trade. I took them with the intent to sell, but decided to keep them "temporarily" to pull a streamlined PRR passenger train that Pete was working on. The long-term goal was (and still is) to pull the consist with an E-unit or two, but that project is still a long way off. The third unit in the PA lash-up came from Bob Turner (thank you, Bob). I have posted this video before, but for those that may have missed it, here are the PAs and the streamliner:

https://youtu.be/g-NeZnd-gNU

Brother Pete built and finished the diner and observation in this train. The remaining cars came from eBay, a lucky purchase during the holidays back in the great recession.

By the way, the Overland Y3a turned out to be of lesser quality than the photo might have you believe. The friend I traded it to reported that it started falling apart shortly after he started running it. He wound up completely replacing the stamped sheet-metal valve gear with solid parts and otherwise made many other upgrades. He didn't talk to me for a year. I only ran it twice in the time I owned it, as it didn't negotiate the curves on the club layout well. It did run well otherwise:

https://youtu.be/gR7yuy-Qz8k

Jim

[steamaheadstephen59]

I modified the nose on this one, It has a story to tell as well. My wife and I had to move, seven kids in a small three bedroom house thing. Sold the house to a single guy, who wonted to move in before the contract was finalised. I said no! but tolled him he could use the garage to store his stuff ( moving is trying for all ) The conversation took place outside the house, and I had a trailer full of my train stuff, out of my view. A few days latter I was at a swap meet, and spied a table with O scale on it ( unheard of almost in Aussi ) I chequed it out, I was thinking there is something familiar about this Central PA, and the work on the nose, and then It dawned on me, this model is mine!!! I told the man selling it, it was stolen , he was shocked, but co-opritive. It turned out a friend of a friend, asked him to sell it, It turned out to be the man buying our house. It was lifted with other train stuff during our conversation, whilst he was out of site behind his vehicle on that day, I had said no to him. The agent went go between, or I would have pressed charges. It was all returned So! Im grateful this one is still with me. It could have been months before I realised it was gone,( I don't usually go to swap meets, no O scale ) my gratitude lifted high.

[bob turner]

Cannot see your nose mods from here - let us know what you did? I took a lost wax nose, split it between the sides and hood, and vertically through the headlight, then narrowed it down to a taper. Then I overlaid the windshield with brass sheet, and outlined where I thought the windows should be. Then I gave it away in semi-disgust. The snout was simply not long enough, and the windshield area was too high. I may yet try that again, with some serious surgery in both directions.

Since I am here, and putting off my daily trip to the airport, I shall look for another PA photo. In a minute.

[bob turner]

First, that nose: Here's what I think has to happen to make this ok:

Completely remove the hood. Then remove the nose about 1/4" in front of the windshield with vertical cuts. Re-attach it with a 1/4" spacer of brass (no, I haven't measured it yet - just a guess). Use solder, brass, and 2-56 brass F/H screws.

Then split the nose at the headlight to get the taper.

Then add .040 brass to the top of the nose before re-attaching the hood. Solder is enough here, assuming the sides and nose are pinned. Might need to make a new hood - I think I will just attach bar brass at the back.

This way the windshield area is reduced. Then a layer of brass with much more artful windshield openings, and back on the etched shell.

This first attempt shows you just how bad the original is. The unit on the right is MTH (in nickel silver). The MTH windshield is not perfect, but it is a lot closer. The Lionel windshield on the 83000 series models is about perfect, as is the Key.

[bob turner]

I think this is the one I finished in Alclad "Stainless." I think you can see the windshield on this one is pretty darn good. You should know that the builder gets to cut the windshield, and I cannot imagine being able to do it with hand tools. I use an end mill before soldering, and a carbide burr after assembly, followed by jewelers files.

[steamaheadstephen59]

There was an article in 'O Scale Railroading' I think. I basically followed that article addressing the Central PA nose anomalies, and possible corrections. I filled the roof area above the windshields, lowering it, and also the window openings, then over lade them with sheet brass and created new openings. I created a new brow extending down around the side windows and vents. I have considered narrowing the nose with a big fill, but na! too many other projects, it still needs work. I dont think the nose will ever quite look long enough.