Western Maryland F-3 Locomotives

[rrjjf]

To all of you diesel experts,

I will start here trying to find some information regarding the subject locomotives. I am currently assembling two CLW F-3 Phase 2 Locos. I picked up these kits recently at the Enfield O Scale Convention. Mechanisms are complete and I am assembling the carbodys. According to the book I have on WM diesels, their F-3 locos were delivered in 1947 without Dynamic Brakes. CLW instructions mentions that their kit can be built without the rectangular rooftop grills and they offered a blank cover to model that option. My kits came with the cover plate that has very nice chicken wire grills to go in the slots located in the roof. I can easily fabricate top cover plates that are blank however, I can find no photos of the WM F-3 units that show this detail.

In 1953 the locos were sent back to EMD and upgraded with Dynamic Brakes and a large round fan housing was installed where the rectangular vents would originally have been on the F-3. The two F-3 locos Nos 51 and 52 were the first locos to receive the speed lettering paint scheme that was put on them during their upgrade. I want my locos to have the earlier Fireball paint scheme so the question is, did the locos in their original configuration have the rectangular vents or was there a blank cover with no vents as CLW offered?

Any solid input on this will be aprpeciated. I have searched the net but cannot find a photo of thee locos showing the top as they were built.

Thanks,

Joe

[R.K. Maroon]

Joe -- I know this is not the reply you were looking for but, not being a diesel expert, this is the best I can do:



I recall posting this before but I am sure the original got wiped out in the last tidal wave. I was not exposed to the WM as a kid and have no allegiance to it, but I do like the fireball logo.



This was one of my first doorstops. My first thought was to strip and refinish in something different but now am leaning to restoring the finish as it is. The original finish seems to be of good quality and I could use more experience at restoration. The main question to resolve is how do I clean this without screwing up the paint or decals.

Jim

[E7]

You could try:

http://westernmarylandrhs.com/

or maybe the B&O museum which has a WM F7.....obviously not an F3, but maybe they have info/pics.

[Tom Dempsey]

Also an ALCo FA-2 R.K.

[ScaleCraft]

Maybe WM will be easier to sort.
I know years ago, when researching NP F units, I found an odd paragraph about the filtering on the sides as delivered did not provide enough or proper filtering.
So, EMD provided new sides, which went from three portholes to two and a set of louvers in the place of the middle porthole.
Photos support that...except the latest book has F-3's (chicken wire and all) in 1966 with..three portholes.
Oh, and numbered (and identified as such) F-3's with horizontal louvers in place of chicken wire.
Some even have had the fans replaced to be the lower F-7 style.....it just flat boggles the mind sometimes.

[sarge]

Joe

Back to point, I'll stick my neck out relying on print rather than any photos I can point to, for as-built photos from overhead of these two units aren't readily found by me, either.

With no photos around to prove otherwise, you are 95% safe in using the slotless panels, painting them in the fireball scheme as built with no dynamic brake.

The rest of the history might be complication for you at this point.

[R.K. Maroon]

Also an ALCo FA-2 R.K.

As I said, I am no diesel expert, but from what I can gather the WM FA pictured is an FA-1. Please let me know if this is not correct. The model is one of Ken Krayer's "Ken-Kraft" models from around 1950. Yes I know it's not "on thread" but 38 people had viewed Joe's post when I saw it and no one replied, so I took that as an opportunity to show the only WM model I own.

Jim

[bob turner]

I do not remember seeing your FA before.

If you are feeling courageous, try this: wash carefully with mild soap and warm water. Dry carefully without leaving lint. 24 hrs later, apply Future Floor Wax with a Q-Tip, one direction only. Start with roof to get the "feel."

Another day later, you can lightly buff, or you can shoot "Dullcote." Or even Scale Coat clear gloss, which can be polished.

I do the "Future" trick with most Diesels and passenger cars. Even some lithographed freight cars get the treatment. Decals can go under or on top of Future. It is a water-based acrylic, and can act as a barrier.

[sarge]

Jim

You're better at this than you give yourself credit for being. It is indeed an FA1.

[De Bruin]

RE Joe, sorry I have had zero luck re roof shot for the original as delivered WM F3, they're all sporting the big DB fan and (again) multiple captions indicate these got rebuilt with grills and re-worked sides fairly quickly; they all looked like F7's to me in the photos. Also kudo's to WM's shops, it kills me how much skill these little eastern regional roads had in keeping their investments runnning well. CNJ and Reading come to mind as well.

RE- Jim's FA1 , The problem with keeping a single cab unit in (whatever) is typically it doesn't "look right" running by itself. Sure FA's ran by themselves, notably photos of PRR, GM&O examples on locals as I recall, ditto CN MLW FPA's. So (opinion) if you keep this guy with the intention to scoot it around you know you're gonna need a B unit, Gp, RS, or F in matching paint to keep it company, oh yeah and perhaps another NE style caboose?
just saying..........8^)

Pete

[Chris Webster]

Joe, The Jan/Feb 2000 issue of Diesel Era magazine had an article titled "Diesels of the Western Maryland." I do not know if the article includes the photo(s) you need.

[E7]

Joe,

If you know what "phase" they were, that might give you the answer. Per Wikipedia:

Phase I

Built from July 1945. High, flat-topped 36 in (914 mm) roof fans. Top third body panel had "chicken wire" in openings only. Short rear vent panel. Center-third body panel with three equally-spaced porthole windows and D17 traction motors. As-built Phase I F3 units are identical to the F2, they differ only in electrical equipment and numberboard size. Three highly modified locomotives survive from this series, rebuilt as FP10s, all for Metro-North Railroad.
Phase II (early)

Built from February 1947. Top third body panel now had full-length "chicken wire". Long rear vent panel. Center third body panel now had two portholes; area between covered with chicken wire, over 4 smaller rectangular openings.
Phase II (late)

Built from December 1947. Roof radiator fans change to low, pancake fans.
Phase III

Built from March 1948. (Surviving F3's former BAR 42,44,46 are still Phase 2 and were built in MAY 1948) Center third body panel now has no chicken wire between the portholes; the four rectangular openings now have louvres.
Phase IV

Built from August 1948. Chicken wire upper-third panel is replaced with full-length horizontal stainless steel grille.
"F5"
Built from August 1948 through end of F3 production in February 1949. D27 traction motors with heavier-duty cables and higher capacity traction motor blowers fitted. Nearly all previously built F3's received the same upgrades by 1955. The note in the January 1, 1959 EMD Service Department Locomotive Reference Data states, "All F5 locomotives were delivered as F3 units." All EMD DC traction motors are backwards compatible so as the better motors became available the D37, D47, D57, D67 and D77 all could be found on an F unit.

[Seaboard Air Line Fan]

Here's some data I gathered when I was looking for a Seaboard F3:

Phase I..January 1945 to June 1947 Same as a F2..small combination numberboards/class lights; 3 portholes and no filters in the middle side course; tall fans; chicken wire screening in three pieces on the upper side course.

Phase II..June 1947 to June 1948 large numberboards; tall fans/countersunk low fans optional; two portholes, center porthole eliminated and substituted with four horizontally slotted air filters between them; larger openings at the rear of the upper course; chicken wire screening covering the upper course and the entire area between the portholes in the middle course.

Phase III..June 1948 to February 1949 large numberboards; Countersunk fans with grill type openings;two portholes with four horizontally slotted air filters sets between them;chicken wire covering the entire upper course only.

Phase IV..August 1948 to February 1949 same as Phase III with a fabricated horizontal stainless steel grill covering the upper course; two portholes with four horizontally slotted air filters sets between them; These were equipped with F7 traction motors and are sometimes referred to as F5's.

I'm sure I got this from one of the Mainline Modeler mags, I'll look to see if they have anything on the WM engines.

[milepost57]

Joe,
Last night I looked for a photograph of the top of a WM F3. This would have been engine numbers 51 or 52 in the “as delivered” state or before the rebuild still in the fireball paint scheme. I was unable to find any photographs. What I did find was photos of the top of F3’s of other roads that did not have the dynamic brake option. With the dynamic brake option the engines had two screen covered rectangular opening on a large screwed down cover just behind the cab. Engines without the dynamic brake option would have had the same large screwed down cover but without the rectangular openings. So, my assumption would be that the WM F3, as delivered without dynamic brakes would have had a large screwed down cover but without the rectangular openings.

One must wonder what the WM was thinking when it ordered these F3's without dynamic brakes.

Dave Eisinger

[rrjjf]

Dave,

Thanks for you input on this. This afternoon I applied some layout bluing dye to a section of 0.015 brass sheet and will cut out two blank covers for my F-3 locos. I can punch some rivet impressions around their perimeter on my milling machine and that will be the end of this until I get them painted and someone comes up with a photo showing grills on the top.

Years ago, I reworked an AN F-3 to look like a WM unit following an 1970 article in RMC where an O scale modeler built one of the AN locos into a GM&O F-3. He modified the side panels and installed the chicken wire screening and I did the same. No mention was made of the Dynamic Brake ventilators on the roof and perhaps the GM&O locos had dynamic brakes. If Bob Smith of CLW had not mentioned this in his instructions I would never have considered doing this. His kit instruction parts list shows two different roof hatches, one blank and the other with the Dynamic Brake grills and apparently he did not supply both types with his kit.

I hope to see you at Strasburg.

Joe